Reporter: Social transformation is a common phenomenon that all countries in the world have experienced or are experiencing. Please talk about some of its main features from the perspective of sociology.
Lu: From a sociological point of view, the so-called social transformation is essentially a transformation from a traditional society to a modern society. More specifically, it is a transformation from an agricultural society to an industrial society, from a rural society to an urban society, and from a closed and semi-closed society to an open society. Its core and main line are urbanization and industrialization. From the perspective of world history, this transformation began in Europe and has now spread to various countries and regions in the world. Now it can be said that no country or region has not experienced or is experiencing this transformation, but the time is long and short, some are smooth and some are difficult. In other words, this is a general change and a great leap for human society. This change involves a wide range of aspects and contents, including changes in productivity and production relations, changes in lifestyle, and changes in thoughts, consciousness and concepts. Simply put, in agricultural society, people mainly work in the fields, while in industrial society, people can work in factories. Although working in the field is a little bitter, it is relatively free, and working in a factory is subject to the constraints of centralized labor system, which is quite monotonous; Units that produce and live in rural areas and fields can be a family, relying on relatives, friends and blood relations, while in cities and factories, it is not and impossible to organize life and production by blood relations; In agricultural society, there is a gap between the rich and the poor between landlords and farmers, and this gap becomes even bigger in industrial society. With this change, many contradictions and problems have arisen, such as the conflict between superiors and subordinates in the field of social governance and management, the widening gap between the rich and the poor at the social level, family division, rising divorce rate, drug abuse and drug trafficking, prostitution and human trafficking, and so on. People use one word to sum up these social problems, and that is "social transformation disease". Sociology is produced in the process of thinking, explaining and governing these social contradictions and problems. Marxism and Comte's positivism were both new ideas and theories with great influence at that time. Although they are different, they all discuss how to solve various social contradictions and problems at that time on the premise of acknowledging social progress, so as to ensure the orderly operation of society. The lesson we should learn is that, strictly speaking, from a sociological point of view, there was no or almost no first-hand record of the whole transformation process of western society at that time, and people could only understand it with the help of some literary works, such as Les Miserables, Red and Black and Balzac's works of "critical realism". The characters in these works are also the characters in the transition period of western society. Through them, we can understand and master the living conditions and specific characteristics of western society in the transitional period.
Reporter: Compared with the situation in western countries, what is unique about the social transformation that China is experiencing? ?
Lu: Indeed, China is now undergoing a transformation from a traditional agricultural society to a modern industrial society. This change is something that each of us can personally feel and experience. I was born in the countryside in southern Jiangsu. Although people used to call it a paradise in the south of the Yangtze River, it was only a prosperous scene under the small-scale peasant economy. The situation now is very different from before. Township enterprises, highways, telephones, televisions and refrigerators are all things that the society that once "worked at sunrise and rested at sunset" did not and never thought of, nor can they be compared. In the past twenty years, the speed of social change is very fast. No matter what resistance it encounters, it is objectively moving towards urbanization and industrialization. This is one aspect.
On the other hand, it is an indisputable fact that the above social contradictions and problems appear in today's society, and there are indeed many people like Stendhal's Julien. When idealism prevailed in the 1950s, these social problems were categorically denied, saying that they only existed in capitalist society and had nothing to do with our socialist countries. I didn't even mention the word "social problems" when I was in college. Later, Mao Zedong put forward the problem of "contradictions among the people", which is mainly manifested in the contradictions between workers and peasants, urban and rural areas and regions. These contradictions are actually the social problems mentioned above, aren't they what we are talking about now? These issues were still controversial in the 1980s. For example, on the one hand, the economy has developed, but on the other hand, the crime rate is rising. At that time, a minister of justice publicly stated that this is a unique phenomenon in capitalist society and socialist society should not appear. This is obviously wrong.
If many of the social problems mentioned above in the process of economic development are similar to those in the social transition period of western countries, then the uniqueness of our society in this transition period lies in the fact that western countries have directly changed from natural economy to market economy or commodity economy, and we have been engaged in planned economy for decades since the 1950s. For the planned economy, to see its historical achievements, we can't completely deny its inevitability and rationality under specific historical conditions. However, from the perspective of the disintegration of the Soviet Union, the planned economy is one of the most important reasons, though not the only one. Because of this, after years of exploration and reflection, we finally chose and embarked on the road of socialist market economy. In fact, in the late 1970s, it was essentially an impact on the planned economy and a guide to the market economy to engage in household production quotas and implement the contract responsibility system. In other words, there are two tasks before us: one is to complete the transformation from agriculture and rural society to industry and urban society, and the other is to complete the transformation from traditional planned economy to socialist market economy. Academics call the former transformation a "social transformation" and the latter a "institutional transformation". The combination of these two changes, coupled with our country's size, population and unbalanced development, makes us not only face and solve the contradictions and problems encountered by western countries in the process of modernization, but also face and solve the contradictions and problems they have not encountered in the transition from planned economy to socialist market economy. The tide of migrant workers, the reselling of registered permanent residence, the dual-track system and the departure of officials are all unprecedented in western society. Therefore, the problems and contradictions we face are not only "piles", but also "mountains"! This is our uniqueness in the transitional period. Our country is currently in the process of these two transformations. All our achievements have been made under this background, and many of our current problems have also emerged in this process. Objectively speaking, our country has become like this and achieved so much, which shows that the basic line set by the CPC Central Committee is correct and our leaders are not simple. This "home" is hard to "be"! ?
Reporter: In the critical period of social transformation, people are very concerned about stability. Please talk about the significance of maintaining social stability in realizing transformation.
Lu: It can be said that stability is the premise and foundation for realizing social transformation, and it is an overwhelming event; Without a stable social environment, nothing can be done, let alone a smooth social transformation. This is because, in order to realize social transformation, a series of social changes must be carried out, and the reform is a complex and arduous social project with great difficulty. Reform is like a high-speed turning train. If you are not careful, you will roll over. China, in particular, is a big country with a population of over one billion, with great differences between the east, the west and the north. It is very difficult to maintain a certain degree of reform. Once some things are not handled properly, they will have bad or even extremely serious social consequences. The central government has handled the relationship between reform, opening up and stability, and always placed stability in a prominent position. In particular, in the past two years, the issue of "reform should fully consider the affordability of the masses" has been put forward, which shows the important role and significance of stability in reform and social transformation. Indeed, reform should take stability into account, and stability is a major prerequisite.
In terms of stability, we have incomparable advantages over other countries in traditional culture. Some people abroad compare China with Yugoslavia and think that one of the important reasons why Yugoslavia has become like that is that it has been torn apart by hostile forces. The ethnic problem is actually a gap problem-compared with Kosovo, the gap between the rich and the poor in Belgrade is about ten times. We still have ethnic problems and regional disparities, which are even greater. For example, compared with Shanghai, the gap between Guizhou and Shanghai is far from ten times, but our society has maintained a certain stability. There are many reasons, and it must be inseparable from the role of traditional culture passed down for thousands of years.
Stability is also a valuable experience we have summed up from the negative lessons of the "Cultural Revolution" in the past decade. It can be said that our development in the past 20 years has benefited from social stability. Although the development of the whole country is uneven, one thing is certain, that is, where the leadership, policies and society are stable, the economic development of the region will be fast. To give a few examples, Guangdong is the fastest growing province, followed by Jiangsu and Zhejiang, Fujian and Shandong. Social stability has played an important role in the economic and social development of these provinces.
In a word, stability is not only a problem to be studied by sociologists, but also a concern of leaders and ordinary people. Everyone expects a stable and prosperous social environment. Moreover, it must be noted that stability is of great significance not only to our country, to the Communist Party of China (CPC), but also to people all over the world. Because in a country as big as China, maintaining rapid economic development and social stability is a historic problem and miracle, which can accumulate valuable experience for the development of human society.
Reporter: What do you think are the factors and problems that affect social stability at present? What are the shortcomings in our work? ?
Lu: People can see some problems. For example, in some places, public security management is chaotic, "pornography, gambling and drugs" are rampant, economic and other criminal activities are increasing day by day, feudal superstitious activities are rampant, and some people collude with some hostile forces abroad to illegally form political parties and societies and engage in subversive and infiltration activities, which has seriously affected China's social stability. Here, I want to point out some deep-seated problems to discuss with you. Because in my opinion, these deep-seated problems are the root of the superficial social "evil" phenomenon and pose a real threat to social stability.
The first is the concept of people. In the transitional period, it is necessary and inevitable to update and transform ideas and consciousness; However, if there is no unified thought and concept, the views of the leadership, academia and ordinary people are inconsistent, which will be a major social problem affecting stability. On this issue, the direction of the Central Committee has always been correct, but there are some ideological tendencies that cannot be ignored in society, especially among some of our intellectuals. Some people have gone too far. They think Mao Zedong is the culprit. They even denied 1840' s anti-British struggle, saying that the Opium War was advanced against backwardness, others were advanced, and we were backward, so we should accept it instead of resisting it, and so on. These ideas, which appeared in the early days of reform and opening up, still have a considerable market, seriously disturbing people's thoughts and directly threatening social stability. We can't forget how the former Soviet Union was in chaos and how it collapsed. One of the most important reasons is the loss of a unified ideal and belief and a unified ideological foundation. First, we denied Stalin, then Lenin and the October Revolution as a whole, and finally denied Marxism and socialism, and denied all the past history. No chaos, no collapse! ?
Of course, when I say ideological unity, I mean to have a core and central thing. For senior leaders and decision makers, only by unifying their thinking can they cope with various social contradictions and problems; For the whole society, only by unifying thoughts can we unite all forces, and Qi Xin will work together to carry out reforms and complete the task of social transformation. Otherwise, you miss yours and I miss mine; You do yours and I'll do mine; What I think and do above is inconsistent with what I think and do below, and the result can only be a mess and nothing can be achieved.
The second is the change of social structure and social differentiation. The gap between the rich and the poor in a country should not be too big, and so should it be between regions, otherwise there will be problems and social contradictions and turmoil. It is particularly noteworthy that Deng Xiaoping's proposal to let some people and some regions get rich first was aimed at the state of "absolute average" at that time. At that time, no one was rich and no one was "poor", but the society lacked incentive mechanism and the economy could not develop. After implementing the policy of letting some people and some regions get rich first, the practice of 20 years has proved to be successful. Some people and some regions did get rich first. At that time, we assumed that the people and regions that became rich first should represent the development direction of advanced productive forces. We admit that the party's policy of enriching the people has greatly improved people's living standards and improved social and economic conditions. But it is undeniable that some workers who work honestly, some farmers who work hard, and some intellectuals who study hard are not rich, and their lives are still quite difficult. These people who were supposed to be rich didn't get rich, but some people who took crooked ways got rich first. Why? I didn't make this up out of thin air, but I have sufficient sociological investigation materials. Why are the people dissatisfied now? This is a very important source. Therefore, the problem of solving the regional gap, the urban-rural gap and the income gap of social members has become more and more prominent, and it has reached the point where it must be solved.
The third is the coordinated development of economy, politics and culture. At the commemorative meeting of the 70th anniversary of the founding of the Party, a senior scholar once said that the biggest problem in the past was "Left", which mainly included two aspects: First, the expansion of class struggle and the pursuit of "struggle philosophy" were "Left" politically and ideologically; Second, the economy is "left". The former "Left" has been cured, but the latter "Left" is still a problem, and the "urgent" problem cannot be changed. People always want to "catch up" and "surpass". We are backward, so we should move forward, don't lag behind others too much, but we should catch up moderately, and only with moderate steps can we be stable. What is the result of "hurry"? Single-handedly promoted the economy, but social undertakings, especially education, science and technology and culture, failed to keep up. In Mao Zedong, grain is the key link and steel is the key link. It seems that as long as both are put into practice, other problems can be solved. Practice has proved that this is impossible. In the past 20 years, we have maintained an average annual growth rate of 9.5%, which is good, but the problem is the imbalance between economic development and social development, which has triggered a series of social contradictions and problems. There are so few universities in our country and the investment in education and scientific research is so low. If we want to develop knowledge economy and modern economy, isn't that a joke? Far away, take our social science research as an example. The national social science fund is only 26 million yuan a year, which is only the money for building 1/4 kilometers expressway. How many decent research projects can hundreds of thousands of social science research and teaching workers across the country apply for only this small amount of money? Our China Academy of Social Sciences also has little funds. I have been the director of the Institute of Sociology for ten years, from 1988 to 1998, without adding a decent set of furniture. Before the handover, I didn't want to embarrass the new team, so I changed the sofa in the office. Society is a whole, and the development of all parts and aspects needs to be balanced and coordinated. In fact, the basic things are urgent, and you can't think as fast as you want. Why is the expressway built so fast and so many times? I think it is necessary to build expressways in some places, but there is no need to build high-grade highways at once. There is no need to build so many expressways. Are there so many cars? Too advanced infrastructure is a waste. It takes about 1 100 million yuan to build a kilometer expressway, and 1 100 million yuan is half a university. Now, to build an expressway of more than 1000 kilometers every year, you have to invest more than 1 100 million. How many universities can you run? ?
We have formulated the strategy of rejuvenating the country through science and education, which is completely correct and necessary. However, the development of science education needs the necessary input from the central government, governments at all levels and society. To rejuvenate the country through science and education, first of all, the state and governments at all levels should promote, invest in and do a good job in science education; Science and education can't flourish if we just talk about it. What I'm talking about is that the current reform should be matched, reform and development should be coordinated, and economic development and social development should be coordinated, so that society can develop healthily and steadily. The reasons behind the above social problems and social phenomena are extremely complicated, but they are directly related to the above three problems-ideological problems, social structure and differentiation, and coordinated development of economy, politics and culture.
Reporter: What measures do you think should be taken to solve these deep-seated problems? ?
Lu: From our sociological point of view, I think at least three aspects need to be done.
First of all, we need to make up courses on developing social undertakings, especially in education, science and technology and culture. We say that social stability requires unified thinking and correct ideals and beliefs, which is only possible under the conditions that education, science and technology and culture are highly developed and the literacy of social members is generally improved. Some truths can only be truly understood, understood and established as an idea, a belief and an ideal if they have certain cultural knowledge. For example, in terms of specific practices, we are indeed different from the era of Mao Zedong. Mao Zedong's mistakes in his later years should be corrected, and what was correct in the past should be adhered to. Regarding the division of "three worlds", can you say that the current world pattern is beyond this range? Without ping-pong diplomacy and Nixon's visit to China, would there be today's reform and opening up? It is impossible to deny history artificially, and it is also impossible to forget one's ancestors after several times. We should treat history correctly and evaluate historical figures objectively and fairly. Take the former Soviet Union as an example. Can you say that Stalin made no contribution? Who defeated Hitler? Who established the status of European superpower? ?
To develop education, science and technology and culture, we must adhere to Marxism, Mao Zedong Thought and Deng Xiaoping Theory. In the progress and change of the times, our thoughts and concepts will inevitably change, and Marxism needs constant development. We can't always repeat and copy things from the 1940s and 1950s, but the basic theory and spirit of Marxism will not change. As early as 1977, when Deng Xiaoping came out of the mountain again, he proposed that it is very important to understand Marxism-Leninism and Mao Zedong Thought comprehensively and accurately, which is very important for developing educational science and culture and unifying the thoughts of the whole society.
Of course, to develop social undertakings and strengthen the construction of spiritual civilization is not just about shouting slogans, but requires material input. Historically, the cultural heritages that have been preserved to this day, such as our Confucius Temple, the Great Wall, the palaces in Paris, and the ancient buildings in ancient Greece and Rome, are the products of the construction of spiritual civilization, both in feudal society and slave society, and have consumed huge manpower, material resources and financial resources. We should truly implement "building the country through education" and "rejuvenating the country through science and education" and increase investment in various social undertakings. Economic development is the center and the first, but we must emphasize the coordinated development of economy and society, and grasp the two civilizations together.
Secondly, it is an effective way to narrow the gap between urban and rural areas, the gap between workers and peasants, and the gap between regions, thus eliminating related unstable factors. As far as the degree of industrialization is concerned, China has reached the middle level in the world, and some indicators have been in the forefront. However, our urbanization is very backward, even worse than India, Thailand and the Philippines. It is precisely because of our lagging urbanization that the income of residents cannot go up and agricultural products and industrial products cannot be sold. A large number of research data show that the higher the degree of urbanization, the more land saved and the higher the economic benefits. For example, South Korea has a population of less than 50 million, and Seoul accounts for 1/5. Of course, the bigger the city, the better, but isn't our current policy-strictly restricting big cities, moderately developing medium-sized cities, actively developing small and medium-sized cities, and now emphasizing "small urbanization"-too conservative? In fact, in order to realize industrialization, farmers will go to cities, and cities will develop accordingly. This is the inevitable trend of social transformation and no one can stop it. Take Beijing as an example, it used to be a political and cultural center, but in order to have enough financial revenue-if nothing else, holding the "two sessions" every year requires a lot of money just to maintain order, and it is necessary to develop its own industry. Shougang and Yanshan Petrochemical, which are polluting industries, can't do it. They must develop in other fields like the electronics industry. From a global perspective, except for a few cities such as Washington, USA and Canberra, Australia, the capitals of most countries are political, cultural and economic capitals with a high degree of industrialization and modernization. Even Germany finally had to move its capital to Berlin, which is not only a political and cultural center, but also an economic center.
Don't treat farmers entering the city so cheaply, what is called "blind flow". It is in line with the law of historical development for farmers to enter cities. Which country in the world didn't realize industrialization and urbanization through farmers entering cities? The ratio of urban population to rural population, the world average level 1996 is 45.5%, and now we only have 30.4%. If it can reach 50%, many problems will be much easier. Accelerating and improving the pace and level of urbanization will fundamentally change the income structure of Chinese residents, and together with other social policies, gradually form a middle-income class that accounts for the majority of residents-at least 70%-80%. The olive-shaped structure with two small ends and a big middle is most conducive to social stability and fairness. In this way, the gap between urban and rural areas, between workers and peasants and between regions will be greatly reduced. This is the case in Japan, and so is most developed countries in the west.
Finally, we should reform the social management system. Many contradictions and problems in the transformation are related to the current management system in China. It can be said that this kind of social management system was basically formed gradually under the condition of planned economy, which is incompatible with the socialist market economic system. Therefore, without fundamentally changing the existing management system, it is impossible to develop social undertakings, accelerate the pace of urbanization, unite people and stabilize society.
For example, the current household registration management system is a very important reason for our low level of urbanization. This kind of management is different from the situation abroad and from the past. It is very special and has many disadvantages, one of which is not conducive to urbanization, attracting and cultivating talents. In foreign countries, people work wherever they work, and the "household registration" system is implemented, as long as they register, which attracts many talents. Zhang San came and Li Si came. People with money will come, and people with ability and strength will also come. Those with strength can work, those with knowledge and technology can engage in scientific research, invention and creation, and those with money can invest in setting up factories and shops. Only when people have money can they have taxes. Therefore, there is no foreign city mayor who doesn't try to attract people. What they fear most is that no one or talent can stay. We're not like this. We try to control or even limit the flow of people. Some people will say that many problems, such as grain, cannot be solved without control and restrictions. This is still the idea of a planned economic system, and we are always afraid that the famine of 1960 will come again. In fact, as long as the society is developing steadily, industry and agriculture are developing harmoniously, and the market economy system is perfect, the shortage economy we have bid farewell to will not repeat itself. Therefore, the food problem in modern cities in the future is a matter of "supermarkets", not the mayor's. Food will naturally come in from below, and the task of the municipal department is to improve the environment, traffic and social order and public security. There are 20 million people in Tokyo and Yokohama, Japan. Isn't the social order very good? Now this method of managing migrant workers emerges one after another! After the building is completed, people don't know where to go, and there is no basis for training cadres and skilled workers. This was not the case in the past. Beijing 1959 has built "Top Ten Buildings" and trained a large number of cadres and talents. And now there are more than the "top ten" buildings that have been completed! But what about the trained talents? How many are there now? ?
For another example, with our current education management system, can universities have money? Can the Ministry of Education have money? In foreign countries, if you pass the exam, you will come to school after paying the tuition, and you don't have to worry about other things-where to eat and where to live. What about us? As soon as students enter the school, they eat and drink Lazar, regardless of anything. Nearly 10000 faculty members of Peking University have less than 3,000 teachers, and the teachers who are really in the front line of teaching have not received the best material treatment and working conditions. A university president, who is in charge of the administrative affairs of tens of thousands of teachers and students, is actually a mayor and can't manage teaching and scientific research. Managing a university well is a great learning. There are no academicians in liberal arts, and only the vice president can learn liberal arts the most when choosing a principal. In this case, can social undertakings keep up? Where does the correct world outlook, values and outlook on life come from? Where does the balance of social structure begin? If this situation is not changed, it will seriously affect the cause of reform, opening up and modernization, and affect the completion of our social transformation task. Many problems in modernization, such as institutional reform and state-owned enterprise reform. , are not purely financial and technical issues, but macro social management issues. Without the development of social science and humanities, it is impossible to understand and solve these problems. Taking the western development as an example, it is absolutely necessary to narrow the regional gap and stimulate and expand domestic demand, but how to develop it? What's the natural climate there? What is the humanistic and social background? What are the advantages and disadvantages of tradition? How many years will it take to change? How to solve people's eating and drinking problems? Is there enough water resources there? Have we fully demonstrated these problems? There is no social science humanities-besides economics, there are law, sociology, political science, philosophy, demography and so on. Can this argument be completed? ?
These are my personal thoughts, which are not necessarily correct, and are for your reference only.